Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
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#1530891
Derryn wrote:Why don't you just have a subject of "Tiger club moving into Damyns Hall", which is a statement of fact, rather than trying to turn the subject into some kind of bizarre post-hoc side commentary with half-facts that aren't actually in the thread?


There would be nothing on this forum if people only posted well-informed or factual comment and stuck to the topic. :)
Derryn liked this
#1530895
This thread seems to be getting out of hand.

So in simple steps.

Keith Reynolds , who holds (or held until v.recently) the title of Airfield Manager of Damyns Hall is the Keith refered to in the title.

The resident who disagreed is Derryn who has posted information contrary to what Keith Reynolds has said.

I dont see why this has to be contentious - I reported in good faith what was told to me the morning of the receipt of an email by the Manager of the Airfield. I was told personally that the Gyros have already gone to N.Weald, the occupiers of the hanger had been told they must leave, the Jab flying school had already partially relocated to Spain and the Tiger Club were to take over the Cafe as their base of operation and anyone else wishing to use it needed to have a membership of the TC in one form or another.

Simples....
#1530903
John, Keith hasn't been the manager of Damyns Hall for almost 2 years. He doesn't have any official capacity at the airfield other than a resident pilot and business owner. I get that he's your friend, and that he presented his view to you, but you can't dress this up like there's some kind of misunderstanding between residents and management.

Here are the facts for you, based upon the email and other comms directly from the actual management:
- Tiger Club is relocating to DH.
- All current residents in the large hangar, with the exception of 2, have been asked to vacate the hangar to make space for the TC.
- Some of the residents in the small hangar have been asked to move to make space for offices for the music festival mob.
- All residents wishing to stay, both hangared and tied-down, will need to join the tiger club.
- The cafe and airfield will remain available to visitors and will *not* be reserved for TC-members only.
- I'm told there are currently no plans to build a go cart track (where on earth did that come from??).

I do not know about any other politics going on at the airfield, whether people are moving away from the airfield, why people are moving, and what the other DH businesses are doing. All I am stating is the above which has clearly been stated in the comms sent to me. I get that people are annoyed/angry about being asked to vacate hangars -I get that - but strictly speaking, those of us at the airfield who are on tie-downs do not appear to be materially affected by the move, nor are any potential visitors.
#1530947
Why be so negative and confrontational?

What are the chances of building more hangars? Either conventional or temporary poly tunnel ?

Why turn away a bunch of resident customers willing to pay god money.

Some of those customers might even be in a position to contribute to the cost of building these additional hangars.
#1530962
I'm not sure of the exact threshold figure, however I am certain that an airfield or aviation business, whose turnover exceeds this "threshold" figure does not need planning permission to construct buildings or structures that are exclusively used for hat aviation business - e.g. Hangars. Cafes and offices would not qualify - as they are not exclusive to the aviation business.

AFAIK, you dont need planning permission for a purely temporary structure such as a poly tunnel. It is only when you start laying concrete foundations or flooring that they get interested - as there is the potential to re-use those foundations for a permanent structure.
#1530969
Here are the facts for you, based upon the email and other comms directly from the actual management:


This is only half the story.

Tiger Club has been given a 7yr lease on Damyns Hall from Tim Lyons the landowner, as have the company that does the Lighting Disco entertainment business and are displacing one of the existing businesses from their office.

Existing users of the airfield get a years "pass" to be some sort of associate members of TC if they wish.

TC are to use the existing Cafe as their base, much like they did at Headcorn in their caravan. Visitors will no longer be able to come and go on a free basis.

There maybe two exceptions to the "vacate the hangar" missive, but one of them to my certain knowledge is already looking to relocate as he visited our strip this morning to ask about a space as he is uncomfortable flying amongst a group of mostly non-radio aircraft.

The Gyros have gone to N.Weald and the Microlight flying school has already moved part of its business and is continuing whilst he can.

There is nothing confrontational in what I say - I wish the residents the very best in their efforts to relocate, or remain, as they wish.

Keith was the Manager at the airfield from its inception in its current form when he left Rochester after being asked to manage DH. He has been involved in the struggles through the planning process, the enforcement issue and the battles with local residents and the council. In more recent times he has as you say handed over the reigns but still remains very close to what is happening and I have no reason to doubt what he has said. He has no reason to make it up.
#1530973
Flying_john wrote:Existing users of the airfield get a years "pass" to be some sort of associate members of TC if they wish.


This is correct. As TC will become the airfield club, residents will be required to join the club. The owner has offered to pay the first year of associate membership fees (i.e. a member who doesn't hire the TC aircraft - we can pay additional for hiring membership)



Flying_john wrote:TC are to use the existing Cafe as their base, much like they did at Headcorn in their caravan. Visitors will no longer be able to come and go on a free basis.


This is *incorrect*. Management have been very clear that visitors *will* be able to come and go as they do now, with full use of the cafe, and there are currently no plans to start charging a landing fee. Further evidence of this is that the cafe is promoting itself more on Facebook, suggesting pilots should fly in and check out the lunches and advertising upcoming events. Why would they do that if they were going to just lock visitors out?? I'm sure Keith was just conveying what he thought was the situation at the time, but I'm afraid he was mistaken on this point.
#1530975
Make sure the bases of the poly tunnels are on wheels.

They are then temporary structures as they can be moved.

As they are a lightweight structure stake them into the ground to prevent movement.


no need! I had a coin-op pressure-wash on the garage forecourt. It was approximately 8 feet by 4 and about 6 feet high.....connected to mains water and electricity. ?The nub of the issue was, It was free-standing and not bolted down.

given some steel plates on the ground, it may have been possible to move it with a pallet-truck. Otherwise, a forklift or telehandler would be needed and enough cable and hose would be needed to to be dug up , to enable the movement.....local Planning Officer conceded that it met the definition "portable" , as it was held down by gravity.
I'm sure a Poly-tunnel , standing ON pads would still be "portable" (tie-down ropes/chains are not classified as foundations, neither are the pads to stop the structure sinking into the earth ) Given enough bodies, you could theoretically lift and move the structure.

Faced with such a temporary structure,some planners may be more sympathetic to an application for a permanent alternative. :wink:
I am minded of the huge tarpaulin signs nailed to buildings, because a permanent bill-board would need a planning application.
#1530977
The McGregor ones have bits that you bury in the ground and have a pole sticking up. These can be concreted in or screwed in or bolted on or otherwise secured. The top structure of poles then slot over these and are held in place by bolts or pins.

Popham have a load of them down the back now. Blackbushe have the large ones.
#1531017
With thanks to Derryn for correcting some of the nonsense that has been written above, as the owner of Damyns Hall I will make just one contribution to this scurrilous and ridiculous discussion by providing the facts:

• I have owned, run and subsidised Damyns Hall for 13 years out of a passion for flying – I have always wanted to make it one of the bests places in the country for pilots to enjoy our sport

• This has been challenging, given the perilous economics of flying businesses and the inevitable planning difficulties aerodromes face

• In my early flying days, more than 20 years ago, the Tiger Club and specifically Tony Richards (who was then the Club manager and now manages Damyns Hall for me) were both a source of inspiration and support

• For the past 60 years, the Tiger Club has been an important institution in British Aviation, providing the opportunity for aspiring pilots to challenge themselves to become some of the best pilots in the country

• As a result, I have great admiration for the club and when the opportunity presented itself to bring the Tiger Club to Damyns Hall (it was not told to leave Pent Farm, which is a lovely farm strip but quite remote for most members), I was delighted to offer them a long-term deal to base themselves with us

• I believe that bringing the Tiger Club to DH is good for them, good for DH and good for all of our ambitious pilots, who will love the opportunities it offers

• In order to accommodate the Tiger Club, as we have a shortage of hangar space (yes, some hangar space has been given up to accommodate the team who run our annual music festival, without which I would have closed DH years ago), which has resulted in us giving a month’s notice to some residents, for which I apologise. All are welcome to stay with outside parking, but I realise that for some this is not an option

• It is true that not all resident at Damyns Hall are happy about these changes, and I am sorry for that, but experience has taught me that businesses and communities thrive on the actively engaged and not the actively disengaged and that is what I will focus on

• It is also true that in order to foster a proper club community, all resident pilots will have to become associate members of the Tiger Club and that I have offered to pay their subscription for 2017. Non-resident pilots are not required to be members and all visitors will be welcome in the café

• As has been so for many years, we do not charge landing fees for visiting fixed wing aircraft and we have no plans to change this policy. We remain open to all conscientious and safe pilots who obtain PPR, observe our noise abatement procedures and do not write scurrilous articles about us on internet forums – regrettably this means that John Luck will not be a welcome visitor in the future

• Regarding the reference to flying non-radio, as a pilot who likes to fly to the sound of a radial engine and wind across the wires, I will fly non-radio for so long as it is legal to do so

• Thank you for the collective ‘planning advice’ on poly-tunnels. We would like to be able to offer more hangarage and will investigate this possibility, but do not intend to push the planning boundaries

• Keith was the manager from 2007-2015, for which I am grateful and he continues to operate Rochester Microlights at Damyns Hall. However, after he stepped down as manager nearly 2 years ago, he bought a second aircraft which he bases in Spain, where he instructs and spends an increasing amount of his time, enjoying the sunshine and the life-style – nothing to do with the Tiger Club’s arrival

• So, to summarise, for anyone who loves flying, I believe this is all good news; for those who like groundless intrigue and the teenage banter of online forums, I guess this clarification will be disappointing
Flyin'Dutch', Derryn, A le Ron and 21 others liked this
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