FLYER Forums

Yes it's quite poor that neighboring ATSU's sometimes have no clue or have conflicting information as to what is going on next door.

The extra freecalling and frequency changes to make an inquiry just add to pilot workload.

It's really not hard to publish a webpage to show the status of these areas and for ATSUs to refresh that webpage to inform pilots whether they are live or not.

stevelup wrote:

Marvin wrote:I seem to remember there is an ATIS type broadcast on the Salisbury Plain DAC Frequency when closed.

Sometimes... If they remember... Last two times I've been in the area, just silence on that frequency.

It's the same with the phone - sometimes if you call, there's a recorded message giving status. Other times it just rings out unanswered.

It's inconsistent.

122.750 MHz
01980 674739

130.150MHz now. There's a NOTAM about it.

I have 01980-674710 in my phone which is the correct number as far as I can tell.

Dave W wrote:130.150MHz now. There's a NOTAM about it.

Well so there is... Do you know when that took effect?

A while (some weeks at least) ago - is there a date on the full NOTAM?

6th May.

Guess I need chastising for poor airmanship then...

Dave W wrote:130.150MHz now. There's a NOTAM about it.

Thanks. I've missed that too.

The broadcast on 01980 674739 works for me. In the pastI have found 01980 674710 and 01980 674730 to be answered by humans when I was expecting a broadcast. Er, bit lost for words when that happens...

Cheers - I'll save that number as well!

If military activity is planned, the DA will be notamed as active. On the day, if the military kit goes u/s, or the weather is unsuitable, or the task takes less time than planned, the relevant DAAIS or DACS will be notified and the DA will be deactivated (i.e. "cold"). Depending on timescales, the NOTAM may well not get rescinded (especially where a single notam covers a series of activation periods). So there WILL be times when NOTAMs and reality are not in sync - but always in a "safe" (if inconvenient) manner - i.e. notamed as "hot" but actually "cold"

Routing from Bolt Head to Popham a little while back, I was talking to Bournemouth with a basic service, and as I was planning on going through Wallop MATZ asked if Boscombe were available. "Dunno, I think they go home at 5" If so, why is the frequency active H24.....

Boscombe is a major trials location - they can do short notice test flying at any time of day.

Stu B wrote:If military activity is planned, the DA will be notamed as active. On the day, if the military kit goes u/s, or the weather is unsuitable, or the task takes less time than planned, the relevant DAAIS or DACS will be notified and the DA will be deactivated (i.e. "cold"). Depending on timescales, the NOTAM may well not get rescinded (especially where a single notam covers a series of activation periods). So there WILL be times when NOTAMs and reality are not in sync - but always in a "safe" (if inconvenient) manner - i.e. notamed as "hot" but actually "cold"

.. but how reliably may pilots assume that if DA was to have been 'hot' (with appropriate information to that effect available on the day from relevant VHF broadcast or actively manned military VHF facility), and is unexpectedly 'cold' on the day, that broadcast or facility will still be there and be appropriately updated (broadcast) or available and infrmative ? Or must pilots assume 'hot' if previously NOTAMd (temp or perm), in absence of explicit cancelling NOTAM or live VHF information from a clearly authoritative military facility ?

gasman wrote:"but I agree, it would be helpful if long, predictable, planned, inactivity of DAs were known to local ATSUs and on local ATISs, as well as being NOTAMd. The French system of having a predictably authoritative, daily updated, website of activity would be great. In UK, of course, 'someone would have to agree to fund it'. "

The Defence budget this year is £ 35,100,000,000 - is it not unreasonable to expect the MoD to fund it ?

Especially if they dont want anyone to infringe it with the obviously carp info system we have now...

Thanks, Kanga, but I'm not quite with you. I think here we have two issues running in parallel? (a) the fact that Plymouth Radar was "on holiday" and that Range Info was instead available from Swanwick Mil which was covered in a notam but which appeared not to have been read by the pilot; and (b) the fact that separately the Range was notamed as being active but actually at the time he wanted to transit it was not (for whatever reason).
If a Range is notamed as HOT, then certainly good airmanship requires it to be treated as HOT unless the designated station (i.e. in this case Swanwick Mil) can confirm otherwise.
It's genuinely not clear to me which bit of this you are questioning?
I'm not saying there isn't room for making the system better, that's another matter, I'm just trying to clarify how I believe it currently works.

Stu B wrote:.. we have two issues running in parallel? ..
If a Range is notamed as HOT, then certainly good airmanship requires it to be treated as HOT unless the designated station.. can confirm otherwise.
It's genuinely not clear to me which bit of this you are questioning?
..I'm just trying to clarify how I believe it currently works.

I was merely seeking clarification, which you have very helpfully given, thanks

I shall (continue to) treat all perm and NOTAMd temp DAs as hot unless I get positive VHF indication (broadcast or exchange) from a military source of credible authority relevant to that DA that it is not. I expect this will (continue to) add a few track-miles to my bimbling; so be it.