Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • 6
  • 12
#1643937
@exfirepro , @rf3flyer , @T67M

if I can get away with turning a couple of the mandatory placards into a PDF homepage on the tablet, I think I've got it sussed! Do you think I'll get that past the LAA? :D
exfirepro liked this
#1643940
Tim Dawson wrote:
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:Could


What a helpful post, thank you.

I echo the sentiments that others have expressed about people jumping on this incident and somehow dismissing it. From the tracks displayed it looks certain that this was a situation that was certain to bring two aircraft very much closer than either would have been comfortable with, and that's the best case. The tools on board prevented that from happening.

This is a good news story. Why are some people so miserable?


My pleasure - I enjoy making useful contributions!

It is not about raining on anyone's parade, it is about bringing some realism to the debate.

I was already flying with EC when some from these shores had not finished primary school yet.

So very aware that EC is an extremely useful tool to have in the box. I am also very pleased that the current developments mean that more and more people understand the importance to get themselves sorted out with EC to see.

What not everybody seems to understand is the need to emit something that makes them visible (and not just to a fraction of the traffic)

What a lot of people don't seem to understand is the human factors involved in using EC and collision avoidance tools - clearly demonstrated by what people write on here about the 'need' to see traffic >20 miles away.

EC is not about pretty pictures on a screen and relying on several steps in a chain to get there.

It is about getting pertinent, unambiguous information in your brain so you can deal with it instantaneously.
nallen, Nick, GolfHotel and 2 others liked this
#1643944
It is about getting pertinent, unambiguous information in your brain so you can deal with it instantaneously.

Quite!
At the beginning of this saga I said that the PAW/SD display enabled a rapid acquisition of the "target" and an easy decision as to the course of action. It was so stress free I had time to take a screenshot!!
Tim Dawson, karlbown, exfirepro and 3 others liked this
User avatar
By mo0g
#1643945
Flyin'Dutch' wrote:
It is about getting pertinent, unambiguous information in your brain so you can deal with it instantaneously.


As you deem these things important, can we assume your assertion the traffic would pass a mile behind was because you did not process the pertinent and unambiguous information given to us, correctly?

It would have been nice for the sake of pertinent and unambiguous information in the thread if you had since admitted this, or edited your original post?

Do you now concede that the traffic collision warning was real, pertinent and unambiguous and the resulting avoiding action was necessary, and a collective victory for EC, even without outputting the signal you think is 'necessary'?
#1643948
@mo0g - I think you haven't read my post, maybe you should try again.

For your info, 'I liked' @Paul_Sengupta post as soon as I read it, however as @malcolmfrost wrote just a few minutes here:

It was so stress free I had time to take a screenshot!!

so hardly heart stopping stuff.

Added to that the knowledge that the screenshot was taken after the avoiding action was taken, indicating that the alert and avoiding action had been taken some time before the screenshot was taken.

One presumes the system warned before the threat turned red?

If for the nearly 20 years that I have been flying with EC I would have written a post on a forum about how my life was saved, for every traffic warning received, I wouldn't have had time for anything else.

EC works, we know.

Or was the excitement over the fact that it worked despite

the Maplin effect!


:roll:

Some people take themselves a bit too serious.
gaznav liked this
#1643950
If I can recap:
On only my fourth sector using Pilot Aware I was happily flying in the open FIR and happened to look at my iPad to see a yellow target that I hadn't seen visually. I looked out, saw the target very quickly and turned/descended to avoid IAW Rules of the Air. I started the turn in around 10 secs. After the turn, I ascertained that I was clear and was able to take a screenshot showing the target in red. That was the stress free bit. It lasted around 30 secs total.
I have no doubt, and neither does anyone else, apart from you, that there was a very high possibility of a very near miss/collision, which at c 200kts closing speed could/would have been fatal.
I have used EC in my real job for as long as TCAS has been around, but within GA it is a relatively new system and it is a very welcome development.
If my original post encourages just one more person to use it , that will be worth the aggro!
karlbown, exfirepro, Nick and 7 others liked this
#1643952
malcolmfrost wrote:If I can recap:

I have no doubt, and neither does anyone else, apart from you, that there was a very high possibility of a very near miss/collision, which at c 200kts closing speed could/would have been fatal.

I have used EC in my real job for as long as TCAS has been around, but within GA it is a relatively new system and it is a very welcome development.


1. I have never doubted that EC was useful, see above - and good for you that it worked and helped you to avoid a hazardous situation; that is what it should do and be used for.

2. Why, if you have been using it in your real job for as long as TCAS has been about have you only now adopted its use in GA?

3. Hope that before you made your avoiding turn you looked out below and to the right to ensure you would not plough into someone you hadn't seen and who was not using EC.

Maybe I should add to my signature:

Proud user of EC since 2000.

:roll:
gaznav liked this
#1643968
patowalker wrote:Was being electronically conspicuous a comfort in 2000, when presumably there weren't too many GA aircraft equipped to see you?


I suspect that FD is referring to FLARM & gliders.
gaznav liked this
#1643975
"the Maplin effect" overpriced and behind the trend in the marketplace.

Shirley, with the rapid uptake of PAW , it applies to their competitors?

Remind me again , When was PAW released into the wild and how many UK units have been sold?
When was FLARM released and how many UK units have been sold?

OK? - does that tell a story?.......now, hows about "how many UK units did FLARM sell in the same timeframe from inception, compared to the PAW units sold?"

I am very impressed by the speed of development and effectiveness of the PAW. While Nero fiddled, they've built a hugely cost-effective fire-warning system.

I don't own one, have no dog in the fight, but see a dedicated team making a real contribution to air-safety rather than seeing how much they can fleece the punter for. :P
mick w, ivor.phillips liked this
#1643976
cockney steve wrote:"the Maplin effect"


Used to describe the tangle of wires and boxes and aerials in the early days

Rob P
gaznav liked this
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • 6
  • 12