Primarily for general aviation discussion, but other aviation topics are also welcome.
By Joe Dell
#1436825
Paul_Sengupta wrote:
Joe Dell wrote:Just do it.


But just do it with or without an experienced PPL in the other seat...?


I'd struggle to find someone experienced and more current on type, so in my case it would be solo.

I wouldn't relish having a second pair of hovering hands that I trusted less than my own. Been there. Didn't like it.
A knuckle-rapping stick would have been handy. :(
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By lobstaboy
#1436845
I agree. If I'm sufficiently unsure of my ability to need someone else with me, then I want an instructor. And since I'm going to be using my national licence to do this, the flight with an instructor can count towards my one hour with an instructor requirement.
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By MercianMarcus
#1436850
lobstaboy wrote:I agree. If I'm sufficiently unsure of my ability to need someone else with me, then I want an instructor. And since I'm going to be using my national licence to do this, the flight with an instructor can count towards my one hour with an instructor requirement.


But surely that's not the point. It's not how I see it anyway.

How this might work in my environment (farm strip with various syndicates and circuits not allowed). Pilot A has only done 2 TOs and landing in the last 90 days. He is in no way unsure of his ability to fly. He wants to go on a trip with fellow owner pilot B. This new concession allows him to do so. Under old and EASA rules pilot B must trundle off on his own to the nearest airfield and do a circuit then fly back to base to pick his mate up.
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By GrahamB
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1436853
MercianMarcus wrote:Pilot A has only done 2 TOs and landing in the last 90 days. He is in no way unsure of his ability to fly. He wants to go on a trip with fellow owner pilot B. This new concession allows him to do so. Under old and EASA rules pilot A must trundle off on his own to the nearest airfield and do a circuit then fly back to base to pick his mate up.


Why the need to fly off and do a circuit elsewhere? The requirement is not to do circuits, but take off and land. Just leaving the circuit and returning to land will fulfil the requirement.

I find this whole thing about whether doing your '3' on a national licence in a non-EASA aircraft counts... lose your insurance cover if you had a prang..... arguments, with people looking for problems, hilarious.

Let's say you hold an EASA licence and an FAA certificate, have a share in a group PA28, and were out of currency at the point you head off for a month's flying holiday in the US. You re-activate your stand-alone FAA certificate with a biennial over there, requiring multiple landings, which also counts as your checkout. You pole about for a month in the US, solo and carrying passengers, carrying out dozens of take offs and landings. Is anyone seriously going to argue that your take-offs and landing in a US registered aircraft, flown under a non EASA licence in a non-EU state don't count towards currency on your EASA licence in an EASA type?
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By MercianMarcus
#1436863
GrahamB wrote:
MercianMarcus wrote:Pilot A has only done 2 TOs and landing in the last 90 days. He is in no way unsure of his ability to fly. He wants to go on a trip with fellow owner pilot B. This new concession allows him to do so. Under old and EASA rules pilot A must trundle off on his own to the nearest airfield and do a circuit then fly back to base to pick his mate up.


Why the need to fly off and do a circuit elsewhere? The requirement is not to do circuits, but take off and land. Just leaving the circuit and returning to land will fulfil the requirement.

...


I'm not saying there's not a way round it under the old and EASA rules I was just trying to show that there are circumstances where the new concession is very useful. Even if you don't have to do a circuit the solo flight is totally pointless in the scenario I've given; and now we have a legal way round it.
By GAFlyer4Fun
#1436906
GrahamB wrote:...
Let's say you hold an EASA licence and an FAA certificate, have a share in a group PA28, and were out of currency at the point you head off for a month's flying holiday in the US. You re-activate your stand-alone FAA certificate with a biennial over there, requiring multiple landings, which also counts as your checkout. You pole about for a month in the US, solo and carrying passengers, carrying out dozens of take offs and landings. Is anyone seriously going to argue that your take-offs and landing in a US registered aircraft, flown under a non EASA licence in a non-EU state don't count towards currency on your EASA licence in an EASA type?


In that PA28 example I agree with you as the PA28 is in the list of EASA aircraft.

Supposing you did all of that holiday flying in something more interesting that is not on the list of EASA aircraft, does that count towards EASA 90 day currency?
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By Genghis the Engineer
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1436913
Genghis has held an instructing qualification for the last 4½ years, which is how long ago he cared deeply on the point. Plus of the three syndicates he's in, two of them have multiple instructors as members, and the third hasn't got dual controls anyhow.

Reality - in syndicates this was going on all the time, this ORS, which I vaguelly recall coming along, and rightly so as often they were types for which instructors weren't readily available but PPLs with lots of time on type were. So it's entirely sensible, so long as everybody is sensible about how they apply it.

G

flybymike wrote:Ah, good. I think I can now categorically safely state that, as I suspected, the quote from the AOPA mag is indeed incorrect.
(Incidentally I was surprised that Genghis was unaware of the concession until this thread)
Re: PPLs supervising PPLs - I believe that there was something like that in the pipeline, but I don't recall seeing anything official
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By Paul_Sengupta
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1436914
GAFlyer4Fun wrote:In that PA28 example I agree with you as the PA28 is in the list of EASA aircraft.


Agree? He was just asking the question.

Yes, it counts. Anything in the same class counts as far as currency is concerned.

GAFlyer4Fun wrote:Supposing you did all of that holiday flying in something more interesting that is not on the list of EASA aircraft, does that count towards EASA 90 day currency?


If it's not in the same class - e.g. you did it in a jet, I don't think that counts. Is that right?
By GAFlyer4Fun
#1436916
Paul_Sengupta wrote:...
GAFlyer4Fun wrote:Supposing you did all of that holiday flying in something more interesting that is not on the list of EASA aircraft, does that count towards EASA 90 day currency?


If it's not in the same class - e.g. you did it in a jet, I don't think that counts. Is that right?

I meant a SEP that is not an EASA type. Obviously a jet wont count towards 90 day SEP currency.
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By Paul_Sengupta
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1436917
GAFlyer4Fun wrote:I meant a SEP that is not an EASA type. Obviously a jet wont count towards 90 day SEP currency.


Outside EASA land there is no EASA or non EASA. Even in EASA land it doesn't matter if you do it on an EASA or an Annex II type.
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By GrahamB
FLYER Club Member  FLYER Club Member
#1436927
GAFlyer4Fun wrote:
GrahamB wrote:Supposing you did all of that holiday flying in something more interesting that is not on the list of EASA aircraft, does that count towards EASA 90 day currency?

Paul S has already answered this, but my take is 'WTF not?'

I can't find anything, anywhere, in the EASA regs, nor in the ANO, that says 90 day currency has to be segregated by which authority 'owns the type'.
By Crash one
#1436935
flybymike wrote:
Outside EASA land there is no EASA or non EASA.

Where is this magical place of which ye speak? .....


Far far away, near Utopia